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ShaunKranish
Executive Director
Founders Club
Executive Director<br /><b>Founders Club</b>


Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 3688
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 2:39 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I was arrested and charged with disorderly conduct today while I was at Rock Valley College in Rockford, IL. I did absolutely nothing wrong. I have been wearing my jacket and empty holster/carry-case for the past week. I have received 0 complaints, no one has ever asked me not to wear it, no one has expressed any concern, nor have I even noticed anyone to be alarmed.

I walked into the public safety building (also the police station) today to speak with someone about school policy. I was then detained for 2+ hours and cooperated with them in every way. It was then approaching the time for my next class, and I informed them that I must be going. I was then officially arrested and charged with "Disorderly Conduct". Again to stress, I never offended anyone, raised my voice, made any threatening gestures, or anything else to warrant such an arrest.

I was released with a notice to appear in court and also told I cannot be back on school property until the situation is handled. I am working very hard right now to see that the situation does indeed get handled. I expect the charges to be dropped, but will be very unhappy if it intereferes with my education at all.
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45superman
Corporal
Corporal


Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 588
Location: Southwestern IL (near St. Louis)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 2:59 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

That's outrageous! Did they bother to explain what was "disorderly" about your conduct? Was it somehow related to the empty holster? Sounds like time for a lawsuit.

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It´s the Right to Bear Arms, not the right to bare hands.
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ShaunKranish
Executive Director
Founders Club
Executive Director<br /><b>Founders Club</b>


Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 3688
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:15 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I hate lawsuits and all of that junk. How else do we prevent wrongful arrests though?
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45superman
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Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 588
Location: Southwestern IL (near St. Louis)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:21 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I understand your point about lawsuits, and share your aversion to them, but this is the kind of situation where I think they can do some good. I don't see any other way to make authorities respect our civil rights than to have the courts force them to do it.

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It´s the Right to Bear Arms, not the right to bare hands.
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mack69
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Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 214
Location: NW burbs

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:42 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

May just be time to check to see if Counselor Walter Maksym would be interested in assisting you....Sorry to hear about that issue SAK, holler if there is anything we can do to assist. mack

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"The defense of our liberties is first at the ballot box, then the soap box, then the jury box and finally, failing all else, the cartridge box"
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Don_Gwinn
Newbie


Joined: Oct 11, 2005
Posts: 16
Location: Virden, IL

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:05 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You need a copy of the complaint/arrest report right NOW. I very much doubt that their story will match yours above. If they swore to a complaint that you mildly discussed the issue and then got up to leave when it was time for class, they'd be laughed out.

You're better off discussing this with a lawyer than with us until you know what's happening. I want to ask you lots of questions, but my advice is to CLAM UP and call Walter Maksym.

The other person to call might be Paul Vallandigham; his contact info is available at http://www.gunssavelife.com. I don't believe he does criminal defense but he's a lawyer you know is pro-gun and will do his best to find you the best help. If you use Amsoil through Concealed Carry, Inc. you could call John Birch, but I wouldn't expect much if you don't. I think he's about fed up.

Remember, your first job is to SHUT UP and talk to someone who can give you actual legal advice. If he/she tells you to feel free to come out and talk on the internet forums, then go for it, but he probably won't if you're going to fight this.

If you choose not to fight it, it won't matter much.
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ShaunKranish
Executive Director
Founders Club
Executive Director<br /><b>Founders Club</b>


Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 3688
Location: Rockford, IL

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:07 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I have spoken to Mr. Maksym, and he will be representing me for this matter. He seems like a great guy and very focused on civil rights. I will let you guys know as soon as more is determined. Right now, the primary concern is getting the criminal charges dropped and getting back to school.
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Ashdump
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Joined: Sep 14, 2005
Posts: 43

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:22 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hey SAk, I'm upset and disturbed to learn of this. Take everyones advice, and seek legal counsel. Don't take this sitting down my friend!
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45superman
Corporal
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Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 588
Location: Southwestern IL (near St. Louis)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:32 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I can't imagine a better course of action than getting Maksym involved. Don Gwinn's suggestion of not talking much about it publicly is also a good one. I can't imagine anything you have said so far coming back to haunt you in any way, but he's right--the less you say about this on the internet (unless Maksym says it's alright), the better. Be strong, and do your homework--I think you'll be back in school very soon.

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It´s the Right to Bear Arms, not the right to bare hands.
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rwbazillion
Corporal
Corporal


Joined: Sep 20, 2005
Posts: 788

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 5:13 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

That's a bummer. I'm pretty sure the charges will get dropped. It's simply intimidation tactics.

You wouldn't get anyone who will complain against you directly, man, most times it's behind your back; where you are the last one to know. The police who saw you with a holster wanted to send a message to you that's all.

Does it make it right, not really. Sometimes you have to look at it from the other college students perspective. When you see someone with an empty holster walking around campus; what is the next thing they think about. "Man that person has a gun". Shocked The next thing they think about is Columbine.

But you never know. An empty holster could be a fashion statement. You may see supermodels walking down the runways with them. Laughing
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GlockShooter
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Joined: Sep 10, 2005
Posts: 163

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 6:18 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

For all they know, you could have been using the holster as a convenient way to carry your calculator! I could see them detaining you, figuring out there was no threat, and telling you that if they see you wearing again they were going to arrest you, but under the circumstances, I can't see how they have any legal recourse.

At the very least, someone should lose their job for this! Obviously, your legal counsel will tell you what's best, but this smells like harassment.

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Now listen up, you primitive screwheads. See this? This... is my boomstick! The 12-gauge double-barreled Remington. S-Mart's top of the line. -- Ash
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45superman
Corporal
Corporal


Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 588
Location: Southwestern IL (near St. Louis)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 6:48 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I'm not trying to presume to tell Mr. Maksym how to do his job, but it seems to me as if this is, at least to some degree, a First Amendment issue. After all, you were (to my understanding) wearing the holster and jacket to raise awareness of gun rights issues. It sounds as if this arrest was intended to silence your expression of these views. That could work for you, if you eventually want to go to the press (with Mr. Maksym's approval, of course)--the media is notoriously uninterested in defending the 2nd Amendment, but they are lightning quick to bring everything they have to defend the 1st.

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It´s the Right to Bear Arms, not the right to bare hands.
My gunrights blog
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mack69
Private
Private


Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 214
Location: NW burbs

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 7:07 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Great point 45....the media gets all bent outta shape regarding 1st amendment violations....care less about 2A violations....

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sigp229
Newbie


Joined: Oct 11, 2005
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 7:50 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

First, let me say thank you to SAK for creating this site. No one will be happier than I when IL becomes a shall issue state. I have a carry permit for Iowa and want IL to join the enlightened crowd.

That said, I have to wonder how little SAK really understands about carrying. I can't understand how anyone who carries on a regular basis can overlook the possibility of a disorderly conduct charge if they try to be in your face about carrying (legal or not). The charge of disorderly conduct has nothing to do with if you felt you were offensive or upsetting, it's all from the other persons' perspectives. I'm sure your lawyer will get that point across.

Seems to me, a guy's got to be stuck on stupid to get out of bed, strap on his Blackhawk tactical thigh holster, slip on his new I Carry "Raid Jacket", and head down to the local college to speak with a college official. I'd bet most people working at or attending college might be a bit liberal leaning, and not the type to pat you on the back for having the guts to stroll around campus with a SWAT style holster (empty or not).

I wish you luck with your case, mainly because I do not wish to see anymore bad press (that's all that gets printed when it comes to this issue) for our side.
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45superman
Corporal
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Joined: Sep 08, 2005
Posts: 588
Location: Southwestern IL (near St. Louis)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2005 8:03 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I disagree. I think the only way we're going to change gun attitudes in this state is to get right out in the anti-gunners' faces and make it crystal clear that we're not going away, and they're not sweeping this issue under the carpet. If there was nothing disorderly about his conduct, then a disorderly conduct charge is a crock of excrement. If there's nothing in the school rules against wearing empty holsters and ersatz "raid jackets," he has done nothing wrong, except challenge some preconceived notions. I thought institutions of higher learning respected that kind of endeavor.

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It´s the Right to Bear Arms, not the right to bare hands.
My gunrights blog
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